Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Hello, friends, and welcome back to Unfeigned Christianity, the podcast where we seek to become Christians who are theologically anchored, emotionally and spiritually healthy so that we can love others. Well, I'm your host, Asher Whitmer, and today I want to talk about something that was circling social media last week. It's kind of a week old, perhaps, but I've been contemplating a few things in light of it. Now, the gist of what it is, I don't. If you're on social media, whether that's Facebook, Twitter, or I don't know that it was really circling Instagram and stuff like that, but YouTube, so forth, you probably saw it. But Astronomer, a company called Astronomer, had their CEO and their HR exposed as having an affair at a Coldplay concert.
[00:01:02] Now, Coldplay was running this kiss cam, like you might see at sporting events. And it, you know, a kiss cam is where you show people who look like they're couples, and then when they realize they're on camera, then they're supposed to kiss. And then you go find another couple to do that.
[00:01:21] Well, it displayed, the camera displays Andy Byron, who's the CEO of Astronomer, and Kristen Cabot, who's the head of HR at Astronomer, and they're cuddling as though they're a couple. But when they realize they're on camera, then he ducks out of way. She hides her face and turns and tries to get out of the frame.
[00:01:43] And it's very obvious that Chris Martin, I think his name is with the lead singer of Coldplay.
[00:01:51] He says either this couple is very shy or they're having an affair. And it's very obvious to anybody watching that it's probably the latter, that they're having an affair. They're not shy. You don't separate for one thing and duck out of the way if you're just shy. But rather, they were caught in a way that was clearly not how they should be. And what makes matters worse is both of these individuals were married, so they.
[00:02:26] They were clearly cheating on their spouses.
[00:02:30] And there's been a lot of, like, on one hand, there's been.
[00:02:34] People make. Find it very funny. Like, for one example, the.
[00:02:41] The way they reacted makes it look exactly like they're having an affair. And it's just hilarious. Like, in your attempt to hide, you actually expose yourself. Because if they would have just acted like normal to everybody else in the world, except for those who knew them, nobody would have known. Well, now they're all over the Internet because they tried to hide.
[00:03:04] So on one hand, it's sort of funny. It has this angle of irony and, and also just the kind of the, the logic behind all of it. If you're having this secret affair that you're going to want to hide from cameras, why are you at a public event like a Coldplay concert?
[00:03:27] And so just the, this lack of, of logical reasoning that plays into it. I think that's part of, part of what people find funny.
[00:03:38] Well, then there's also mixed into this, a bit of anger. People angry at Coldplay for, for doing this. People angry at news outlets and other folks around social media who are, are spreading this story and exposing the people like why, why do we take revel. Why do we delight in their downfall? What's that German word to delight in someone's misfortune?
[00:04:08] Schadenfreude. Like, are we, are we fighting schadenfreude in these people's downfall?
[00:04:17] I found out about the. Well, let me hold off on that. There's also a surprising amount of people who are like, what's the big deal with this? That's, that's his work wife or whatever.
[00:04:31] And that just kind of shocks me. Like the idea that people would have publicly known, you know, not really hiding from other people, that they have a quote unquote work spouse that is someone they're extra special close to at work as opposed to in their real life or in, at home and in their family life.
[00:04:56] I found out about this because I saw Ed Stetzer, who is. He writes over at Church Leaders and podcasts over there.
[00:05:05] I don't know, he used to teach, maybe still does teach at Talbot Seminary.
[00:05:11] He shared it on social media and just his comment was. All he sees is the pain and devastation of the spouses and the, the generational. I'm paraphrasing, I don't remember exactly what he said, but generational repair that is going to be in place because of infidelity and the affair that this causes.
[00:05:34] And I've been sitting on this thinking about it, and I realize that for a lot of my audience you may not have necessarily seen it. This isn't happening in the church necessarily.
[00:05:51] I have seen some people, some friends of mine on social media and so forth share it because both of them have since resigned and they were first placed on leave. Byron resigned and now I saw in the last day or so that Cabot has also resigned.
[00:06:10] And so some people are comparing it to the church. Why do, why does this secular company do a better job at holding its people an account accountable than the church?
[00:06:22] And I get the point of that, I'm not sure that it's a fair comparison because the company's very clearly doing image repair and reputation repair. They're in it for financial stability and gain. Not so much about integrity of character and leadership.
[00:06:42] But I understand the sentiment because. Because there's a lot of people in churches that are in a position of leadership and power who are maybe abusing people, not just having this consensual affair and living in sin, but going further and being predatorial on people.
[00:07:06] And we're not taking things seriously enough to move them, remove them from their position.
[00:07:14] As I've been reflecting on it, there are a few things, two things specifically, that I think about that I think we, as Christians, whether or not we are aware of this particular event, I think this is a good opportunity to reflect on two truths.
[00:07:38] And if you're watching this, you've noticed the title of this episode is Love is a Battlefield.
[00:07:47] And the reason I think about that is part of it was I was listening to the Esau McCauley podcast, and he brought this up, but it was very much in line with what I was already thinking about this particular situation.
[00:08:07] And that is that in order to maintain love and intimacy with a spouse for life, it is a battlefield.
[00:08:20] And I mean, my. My wife and I have faced that in a way, I think, for me personally, I look back, we've been married this November, it'll be 13 years that we've been married.
[00:08:33] And so as I look back over the last six years, six to seven, if I think of like half our marriage ago, I think in many ways, like, when I first started out, I was the kind of guy that read a ton of books before I was dating, even, but definitely before I was married.
[00:08:54] When I found out we were pregnant, we got pregnant very soon after marriage. So I'm, like, done reading the marriage books, and now we're, like, in marriage. And now I'm reading all the parenting books and trying to get that figured out or prepared. And there was. I knew I wasn't figuring anything out, but it was just an attempt to be prepared and, you know, to have to learn from other people about something that I've never done before.
[00:09:23] But then as we entered the middle stages of marriage, I look back and I see myself coasting.
[00:09:33] Our marriage has been very good in many ways. There are aspects of married life that are far better than I thought they would be.
[00:09:45] And there's a variety of things that play into the picture that I got some of that was the books, even that I Read, my wife and I just genuinely did not struggle with some of the things that, you know, couples are supposed to struggle with. Typically, stereotypically, there are other things that, yeah, the books talked about, and I didn't realize how big of a deal it is. A classic example would be just communication, like staying in good communication between a husband and wife. Like, I cannot emphasize that enough. Like, that is a huge thing to learn how to communicate well and to develop rhythms of communication early on in your marriage and to maintain those open channels of communication.
[00:10:43] That's an area where I would say that's harder than I even anticipated, even with reading books or listening to other mentors of ours who talked about that recently.
[00:11:01] And I would say within the last year and a half, I have realized just how much marriage and intimacy in marriage is something you have to fight for.
[00:11:16] And the reason why we have to fight for it is because there are other things fighting for intimacy with us.
[00:11:25] And so.
[00:11:27] And you don't just. It's. It's not like there's a magnetic pull to each other where you're just locked in until there's some greater force that pulls you apart. You are either growing as a couple, growing together in intimacy, or you're drifting farther apart.
[00:11:47] And so either we're growing and we're continually honing our skills at being intimate emotionally, spiritually with each other.
[00:12:03] And I think all of that, in some ways, when you get farther into marriage, it's harder to maintain emotional and spiritual intimacy, perhaps than even physical intimacy. Now, a lot of this depends on your story and some of the experiences that you have had going into marriage. But you can get to this place where physical intimacy is almost one of the easier things to do. And it's like the way you can be intimate with each other.
[00:12:34] And that's something that my wife and I have been discussing and just realizing the need to fight for our emotional and spiritual intimacy because of the different types of intimacy. Physical intimacy is probably one of the.
[00:12:55] Trying to choose my words carefully. I was going to say weakest. I don't know if that's a fair, fair thing, but when your heart has left someone, an affair like Andy Byron and Kristin Cabot are having is not that far away.
[00:13:13] And so the fight is to keep your heart towards each other.
[00:13:19] And, yeah, that's just that. That's what I've been thinking about is just as I see that displayed on public media for all to see, the thing that I think about is, like, that that affair didn't start last week. It didn't start a year ago. Probably that affair started in each of those marriages where they began to drift apart and not value and fight for the intimacy. We live in a society that has this.
[00:13:53] This delusion.
[00:13:56] It's stronger than that. It's like this deception that somehow there are like this sense of compatibility with each other and particularly physical compatibility.
[00:14:10] And tethered underneath that is the idolatry of sex.
[00:14:16] That sexual expression is the ultimate goal and ultimate form of love.
[00:14:23] And so what happens is people drift apart emotionally. They struggle to have sexual intimacy frequently enough or in a way that each other likes. Because you're defaulting to modes and methods that are just easy for the moment and quick and whatever.
[00:14:43] And yet there's this underlining tether that sexual expression is like the ultimate form of love. And so if we're not getting that from one another, then all of a sudden our hearts aren't connected anymore. Our physical intimacy is disconnected at best, if not looking like it's completely incompatible. And so then in someone's mind, they can begin to rationalize. Like the sense of drawing and magnetism. Is that the word I'm looking for? Like it feels like a magnet to somebody or something else that isn't your spouse.
[00:15:22] And what's really interesting is that feels like a thrill because it's wrong.
[00:15:28] It's outside of your commitment. And the thrill is a dopamine hit.
[00:15:35] And people often don't realize.
[00:15:41] They think they're finding connection.
[00:15:47] What they're actually getting is a dopamine hit. Because their form of connection is something that's shouldn't be. It's wrong. Our consciences know better.
[00:15:57] And when what we really need is to do the hard work which doesn't produce a dopamine hit necessarily right away.
[00:16:05] The hard work of investing in each other's, in our spouse's hearts and pursuing intimacy with each other.
[00:16:18] Part of why intimacy as couples can be so hard is deepening intimacy involves growing in emotional health ourselves.
[00:16:30] It involves. That involves emotional health involves understanding our stories.
[00:16:37] What drives the attachments that we make, what drives or don't make.
[00:16:43] Some individuals can have the initial connection or charming can. It's easy to get to a place of being married and have a few kids.
[00:16:58] But then the ongoing deepening longevity with a friend is there are things that they begin to check out. They don't even necessarily know why other people bump into that earlier on. Maybe they date a bunch of people, but they have a hard time making the commitment.
[00:17:19] These are the kinds of things other folks might attach quickly and then the partner of the relationship may feel a sense of like they're suffocating because that person is so attached to them. They are the lifeline for that person. These are all different things that stem from our stories. There are pieces of our stories that cause us to have these different responses and attachments to relationships. And if we're going to grow in intimacy, it involves the hard work of understanding what. Why that is, involves the hard work of getting counseling, getting therapy, not because there's some big issue going on, but because we don't want some big issue to go on. Because we want to grow in emotional intelligence, emotional health, and dealing with the wounds of our heart or the patterns of communicating and relating that are actually hurtful or damaging to our spouse or the person we're trying to deepen connection with.
[00:18:38] And so that's just the first thing I've been reflecting on. And part of it is because this is something my wife and I have been journeying in very much ourselves, is that intimacy takes work, life. Love is a battlefield. There are other things fighting for connection with us and for intimacy with us. And sometimes it's good things in the sense of usually the older you get, you have more responsibilities. And some of those responsibilities are very valuable and meaningful.
[00:19:15] Other times it's bad things like habits of disassociation. And so when we. When we are present with our family or with our spouses, we're sitting there scrolling or on TV or drinking wine, kind of trying to check out or whatever, and we're not really aware of, like, what's driving that need to disassociate because disassociation is not helpful or healthy for intimacy and relationships.
[00:19:51] Major acts of sinful and unjust behavior don't start there.
[00:20:02] They start because people decided they weren't going to pursue health and they didn't do anything about it.
[00:20:12] There's some of us who are like, man, I. I could never do that. How could you ever do that?
[00:20:19] But we may not be taking our emotional health seriously.
[00:20:26] I'm not trying to posit out this sort of fear mentality that, oh, if you're not pursuing emotional health, you're going to end in an affair or in some other major act of sin and wrong behavior.
[00:20:39] But I am suggesting that when we don't take emotional health seriously, we're not going to grow in emotional intimacy with our spouses.
[00:20:56] And who knows where that could lead.
[00:21:00] Yes, there are many couples who, for all practical purposes, are divorced. They're not with each other, and yet they're still living under the same roof. Kids feel that they grow up with, that they know something's missing.
[00:21:15] So it doesn't necessarily mean that you go and have an affair with a co worker at a Coldplay concert.
[00:21:22] But is that the marriage and the legacy that you want to leave with your kids?
[00:21:28] Is that the marriage and the legacy you want to have with your spouse?
[00:21:33] Love is a battlefield.
[00:21:35] Don't neglect it. Don't give up.
[00:21:41] Keep pursuing, keep fighting for the intimacy and the connection with your spouse. The second thing that I've been contemplating and just thinking about as I ponder this whole event is that sin destroys intimacy.
[00:22:05] When we sin, it destroys intimacy and connection with our spouses. And a lot of people see the affair of Andy Byron and Kristin Cabot and it's like, oh, that's awful. That's sinful. At least I haven't done that. What?
[00:22:23] I had that thought as well. Like, man, this sort of, like, my sins aren't that bad.
[00:22:33] But we need to understand something.
[00:22:36] Them getting caught at the Coldplay concert wasn't their sin.
[00:22:41] That's the manifestation of their sin, but that's not their sin.
[00:22:46] The sin happened a long time before that, and it leads to that sort of, yes, they're living in sin, but that's not the sin.
[00:22:57] And some of us are living in sin right now. We're just not getting caught by a KISS camera at a Coldplay concert.
[00:23:05] Private sin of lust is just as wicked as a public affair.
[00:23:11] And how many of us are sitting there wiping our brow that we have not done that, but we're really struggling with lust privately, or we can't.
[00:23:25] Maybe we're not even doing anything about it.
[00:23:29] There's other sins we could address. But in light of marriage and having an affair and everything around the Astronomer scandal, I'm thinking about lust. And I think there are a lot of people, even within the church, Christians, who live with lust and are not dealing with it with the aggression that Jesus tells us to if your eye causes you to sin, cut it out and throw it out.
[00:24:06] Because it's better for you to enter the kingdom of heaven with one eye than for you to be led astray with both good eyes.
[00:24:17] And so are we addressing the sin in our lives seriously?
[00:24:24] And with the aggression of that sort of passion?
[00:24:35] A way to define sin is trying to solve our shame on our own.
[00:24:43] When you look throughout, from Adam and Eve, throughout the biblical story, into our own lives today, what lies at the bottom of sin is this. We feel this sense of shame, and we try to Solve that on our own.
[00:25:01] You have Adam and Eve taking in this message that God's holding out on them.
[00:25:09] And so they feel, they recognize they're naked.
[00:25:13] They were naked and unashamed. Well, then they realize after listening to the serpent, God's holding out on you, so they're going to eat of the tree of knowledge, of good and evil. Well, then they see that they're naked, and then they go and sew leaves together for clothing, which brings this barrier between them and God. They're no longer intimate and connected with God.
[00:25:43] And so when we, first of all don't trust God, that God is good, we then feel the shame.
[00:25:54] And then when we try to solve that shame, we end up doing something that is sinful.
[00:26:01] And so I think it's healthy for us to reflect on what are the things in our lives that make us feel shame.
[00:26:13] And what do we do with our shame?
[00:26:19] What is it that we do with our shame? Do we cast all of our Peter says anxieties on the Lord because he cares for us, or do we kind of hold in our shame, bring fig leaves over it so that maybe God doesn't even see it and he'll approve of us and then definitely other people around us won't see it and we'll be fine.
[00:26:49] Sin destroys intimacy, and intimacy takes work.
[00:26:56] And there have been times in marriage, even after 13 years of marriage, there are times when we sin against each other in our marriage, and that destroys intimacy.
[00:27:15] And then there's need for repair and for to rebuild, to rebuild the trust, to rebuild connection, to go deeper than before.
[00:27:28] I am grateful that our actions and our abilities are not the end of the story.
[00:27:37] The Grace of God, as a song goes by Keith and Kristin Getty.
[00:27:43] The grace of God has reached for me and pulled me from a raging sea and I am safe on this solid ground the Lord is my salvation I will not fear when darkness falls his strength will help me scale these walls I see the dawn of the rising sun the Lord is my salvation who is like the Lord our God Strong to save faithful in love My debt is paid and the victory won the Lord is my salvation Victory and freedom in Christ is not our doing.
[00:28:32] It's not us mustering up our own strength.
[00:28:36] It's something that Jesus has accomplished for us.
[00:28:42] And we walk in faith.
[00:28:45] And we walk in faith that Jesus has actually won the victory. We might wrestle our alligators of sorts, but we do that not relying on our own power or willpower, but because Jesus has already killed and slayed the ultimate alligator.
[00:29:09] We fight for intimacy because we want connection.
[00:29:13] We want place of belonging. We want to love and be loved.
[00:29:21] We understand that sin destroys intimacy, and yet we recognize we are sinful. We have sinned and we confess that.
[00:29:31] And we bring all of that to a good and gracious king who is reaching for us and pulling us up into a life of freedom and victory.
[00:29:43] I just these are the things that I've been thinking about as I ponder what happened with Andy Byron and Kristin Cabot, and I thought it might be a valuable time to reflect on this and look inward at our own lives.
[00:30:00] Curious what are your thoughts? What are some lessons about intimacy with your spouse, intimacy in romantic relationships that you've learned?
[00:30:14] Maybe you are not married at this point, but you've learned something about intimacy and connection with people.
[00:30:22] I'd be curious to hear what that is. Go ahead and drop a comment below. Shoot me an email.
[00:30:28] You can send it to podcastherwhitmer.com or or a DM on any social media. Pretty much any. Yeah, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Threads, LinkedIn. You can find me. Go ahead and share it there as well.
[00:30:46] And if you're interested in going going deeper in growing in theological being theologically anchored, emotionally healthy, and able to love others, well, check out Becoming a Member of Unfeigned Christianity on Patreon. There's five different tiers on Patreon that you can join, actually six different tiers that you can join, starting at $5 a month, going all the way up to a hundred dollars. And for the different tiers, there's different resources that are made available, depending on what you're looking for. So go ahead and check that out. I'll drop a link below. Thank you and God bless.
